It seems that traitor Snowden is on his way to Ecuador via an airport hopscotch through the gulag archipelago of leftist human rights darlings: China, Russia, Cuba, and Venezuela (What, no North Korea? The Dear Leader better not hear of this!) This travel itinerary sort of undercuts the message the dear boy is supposedly trying to send re his deep concern for individual rights and overreaching government.
If he ends up in Ecuador, or for that matter Cuba or Venezuela, he will come to regret it.
At first he will be a gringo celebrity and get wheeled out to this and that leftoid conference to deliver his wisdom. After a bit, however, his hosts will tire of him much as one tires of a cranky pet monkey. He will begin to find that those hosts get less and less hospitable, that his accommodations are not what a "$200,000/year analyst" is used to, and, not too long into his stay, that his phone calls don't get returned and his subsistence checks get more and more erratic. Then one day the government will change, and he will be an embarrassment.
Does the local shelter take pet monkeys? Snowden is about to find out.
He should have realized that traitors can make very nice livings staying in the USA. We need look no further than John Kerry--who is now baying for Snowden's head--and Jane Fonda for proof of that.
I agree with your analysis Diplomad, he will regret it.
ReplyDeleteOn another site I read something a fellow from "my neck of the woods" placed on a thread - it set me to thinking. I copy & paste from his shortening his 'ID' to "Ups":
Interestingly enough Assange is still at the Ecuadorian Embassy, after a year. Snowden, already on his way to Ecuador.
The extradition treaty with HK would have been valid had the charge been criminal felony theft. Many countries don't recognize a Political crime (e.g. Political Espionage) as an extraditable offense, especially back to the offended country. As they say, the fine print will get ya every time.
But do they really, really want him?
The big question that I think one needs to know and fully understand is, just what did Mr. Snowden disclose, and to whom did he disclose it?
As far as I am aware, the entire flap is about him having publicly disclosed facts about our federal government spying on its own citizens.
Do they want him back?, Not really. Much too embarrassing, hence the filed charge. This way they are fairly assured of his not returning and putting them in an even more embarrassing situation.
Interesting comment that. The fellow was in my general "line of work" - different geography though. Thoughts?
Arkie
I hear ya, Mr. Diplomad. You are not wholly wrong about Ed Snowden.
ReplyDeleteOn the other hand, the puzzle for us citizens of the planet -- mere riders on the shifting continental plates -- is now much different than it was only a decade or so ago.
We little, tiny human beings now must confront the technical feasibility of total government surveillance of everything there is to know about each one of us.
SECRET surveillance. Meaning: What it is and what it does are outside our private control.
An issue like this has been addressed many times in literature and philosophy, but never in actual human experience. We are the first society to face it.
Let's hope our response reflects grace with hard ribs, and timeless principle.
I am reminded of the book "Man Without A Country". Those who harbor him will not want him for long but cannot allow him to return home. Which brings me to another book "The Ugly American". He will treat his hosts as if they do not deserve respect as he begins to resent his predicament.
ReplyDeleteHe may be too American and begin to miss America if he is away for too long. At which point, his long suffering host government may allow him to escape/be kidnapped back to the USA. Good riddance to the soft Yankee complainer.
If Snowden does return home, he should be very glad that James Jesus Angleton is long disgraced and dead.
Lee Harvey Oswald. Will Snowden be given a pretty woman as a going-away present?
ReplyDeletePerfect for the Administration. They most likely already have a good idea of what he is in possession of and, while potentially embarrassing, see nothing on the level of what Walker or Ames gave away (crypto and agents identities).
ReplyDeleteSo the more we play the game of "Catch me if you can (want)" on the front page, the better the chance of the NSA data collection on US Citizens has of becoming just another Right Wing Birther Conspiracy...soon to be sent down the memory hole.
@ Anon above,
ReplyDeleteLet's hope our response reflects grace with hard ribs, and timeless principle.
There was a time in my young life when, just after the 'duck & cover' exercises we (then children) were presented the difference between our "timeless principles" as opposed to those of the Soviets who were bound and determined to nuke us.
Admittedly this was long before a '57 Corvette rose into the 10K range.
They teach their children to inform on their parents. They do not allow disagreement with whatever they, in their Star Chambers decree. They do such and such - while WE DO NOT!
Of course I was a little kid then and I suppose, may've believed the Easter Bunny (just like ducking under a little desk in third grade) was gonna shield me from blowing the candles out on my birthday cake could be done to OSHA regulations with thermonuclear assistance. But then I dunno, I was a little kid.
But the thing was ... I got to actually having faith [small f] The United States of America was because of the Constitution - above whatever fray and prey the other nasties of the world were up to ... Our elected Representatives "would never in a million years, because we've 'oversight' in the form of "checks & balances" have our "Endowed by our Creator" stuff undone. "Stuff" I realize not in the Constitution rather in the first of the Amendments.
(I'm older now [gasp. cough cough spit] and recognize who I've contributed to, who I've voted for and though I'm not particularly unhappy with my own State's winners - there are some - Senate - old farts who should've long ago been put out to pasture. )
Yeah I know Diplomad you're about to delete this comment, but look to the Senate on Immigration.
I realize we (or at least most I think) know what Snowden did was wrong - me, mainly 'cause I ... "believe oath-taking" actually means something apart from written C[c]onstitutions ... but that's just me I reckon
I'd go on but I'm ending purposefully - I well remember what my early teachers told me distinguished the USA from the USSR. That being, not mainly the 1st nor the 5th Amendment.
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Keep in mind - as was said on the heap of ruins which remained of the World Trade Center, This will not change us!
Just a point of contention, and not to commit threadnomancy, but I must correct the record regarding "duck and cover." Many today ridicule that action, as if curling into a little ball under your desk will protect you from the 10,000 degree fireball. What people have forgotten is, while ground zero of any detonation is rarely survivable (ground zero expanding in size based on the power of the blast), once you are outside the immediate area of the blast you still have heat and shock to contend with. Getting a solid object between you and the blast will protect your body from the heat radiation from the explosion. Getting under something and curling in a ball makes you a smaller target for shrapnel effects from the blast wave (broken glass, etc) while being under something and curling up protects your vital organs from blunt trauma of flying debris and falling objects.
DeleteDuck and Cover is an immediate self-preservation tactic that should be retaught, not ridiculed.
Apologies KellyJ,
DeleteYou are correct of course. In each and every way.
Alas, I'm no longer a third-grader. What I care about [except perhaps for you] nobody else seems to care for. Apparently, our "To Protect and Defend the Constitution" (elected by the People) Representatives either didn't - when the Patriot Act was voted, revoted, then Obamavoted ... oh well.
What I'm getting at KellyJ is pretty simple - 60+ years ago I was "told" we were different. "We" meaning the USA. Nowadays if one of my Grandkids gets thumped on the ear, (fingerflicked as we used to say) I'm given to understand I have, "by all Rights" cause to call the Governor and request - and given appropriate quick attention - a callout to the National Guard.
"Duck & Cover" in 1960 is not the same as "Duck & Cover" in 2013.
Yeah. I've been on a ship or two. I've been in too, a coupla places that should've been nuked - I don't "ridicule" it.
My Dad wasn't on the Missouri, but he got his picture taken. Douglas McArthur you might recall was born in Arkansas. He wouldn't admit it of course. but it doesn't bother me.
I'm actually a pretty nice fun-liking guy KellyJ - thanks for reminding me how much fun vaporiazation can be. Or, should be.
http://www.encyclopediaofarkansas.net/encyclopedia/entry-detail.aspx?search=1&entryID=2768
Arkie
No problems Arkie...I too have seen some places where a few hundred kilotons of land redevelopment would have made a huge improvement.
DeleteAnd if my kid ever gets fingerlicked the only recourse of action I can contemplate is to ask what he did to either deserve it, or retaliate for it.
And I still think "We" are different...only now are We starting to understand We are not alone and the Political Party who We 'thought' would speak for Us is currently more interested in maintaining their individual thrones of Power...even if that means accepting permanent minority status in the New Order.
Made in America tested in Japan.
DeleteI am surprised the Chinese let him go, especially so quickly. Who this guy is and what he really is has been ably discussed here. So I will only say that if he is a tool of the Administration to divert attention from other issues this might be more damaging to them than they had anticipated. It is making them out to look the fools internationally and domestically. To think they are reduced to create scandals to divert attention from other scandals is something to think about.
ReplyDeleteI wonder if China's reaction to Snowden isn't a case of how when you owe the bank a thousand dollars, it owns you, but if you owe it a few trillion, you own it. One commentator in Shijie RIbao (世界日报--admittedly a non-Communist paper) observed that China would lose too much if it got into to deep a diplomatic rift with the USA.
DeleteHence, Uncle Kepha's original surmise that Snowden was in Chinese pay has proven false. My guess is now that he wanted to be the pet monkey of some Leftist regime, but didn't look too far into the future.
"I wonder if China's reaction to Snowden isn't a case of how when you owe the bank a thousand dollars, it owns you, but if you owe it a few trillion, you own it". That's a good guess. He still may have been in their employ, but now he's run. They've got what ever he had, but he can still be used for embarrassment to the US. Just send him down the line to Ecuador and publicly wash your hands.
Delete"At first he will be a gringo celebrity and get wheeled out to this and that leftoid conference to deliver his wisdom." A less exotic version of Philby, but with the same fate.
ReplyDeleteSnowden is a traitor to the Fascist State. Snowden shouldn't even be the issue here. When a government becomes so overbearing that it sets to spying, and in mass and in great detail, on it's own people like they were all subjects, if not criminals, it is not doing so on their behalf. The Stasi wasn't in East German and the NSA isn't in America. I don't think the federal government has stopped a single attack, and has caused quite a number (Fort Hood, Boston, Benghazi, Mexican invaders who kill so many and most every day), with their gross willful dereliction. I don't care how many times Herr Hussein Obama and other NSA supporters and apologists and lackeys tell me that's Holy Water they are spraying on my leg to keep me safe, I know that it's something very different. If there were justice in the world, Snowden would be living it up in the White House and Obama and his NSA Ring Leaders would be in hiding.
ReplyDeleteWhistleblowers acting on their consciences do not flee to China, Russia and/or Cuba, Ecuador or Venezuela.
ReplyDeleteThat, and Snowden apparently got his job under false pretenses.
http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1268209/snowden-sought-booz-allen-job-gather-evidence-nsa-surveillance
I don't have much use for this individual. That potential wrongdoing on the part of this administration has been revealed is almost a collateral effect, given that Snowden is apparently spilling his guts.
I'm still trying to figure out how this dolt got a clearance.
I'm still trying to figure out how this dolt got a clearance...... the same way the African King got clearance, your government is thoroughly infiltrated with traitors.
DeleteAs to Snowden, I am ambivalent, BJ Clinton gave away far more information, Kerry too.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend, I hope he has done irreparable damage to the African king's maladministration amongst the trendies and fawners.
Well Merkwürdigliebe,
ReplyDeleteThe kid did, as has been reported, work for the CIA just after getting his GED.
Now that, apparently got his job under false pretenses, I could (sorta) understand if it was only Booz-Allen --- but a clearance from both the CIA & NSA?
I take it you've got a whole lot of fiber in your diet.
________________________________________________
Here's Dick Cheney worrying about what I've been:
Cheney expressed concern that a private contractor was able to gain access to the information that Snowden has leaked, and speculated that someone within the NSA was feeding information to him.
http://news.yahoo.com/cheney-lawmakers-favored-secrecy-surveillance-155337833.html
Of course Cheney mentions too that "lawmakers on both sides wanted to keep the programs secret" - which, when one thinks about it, annulling the Fourth Amendment - I can understand "our Representatives" worrying about their next jobs.
Probably have to work as Lobbyists I'd imagine.
Or worse. On Wall Street.
Arkie
1. Hon. Mr. Kerry and Ms. Fonda are from another era.
ReplyDelete2. Mr. Snowden's crimes against the state will pretty well guarantee him lifetime incarceration, should he show up in the US.
3. Watch what happens to PVT Manning.
V/R JWest
1. Hon. Mr. Kerry and Ms. Fonda are from another era.
ReplyDeleteYes. The first was a Senator and now is Sec/State. The second looks to live into old age comfortably.
2. Mr. Snowden's crimes against the state will pretty well guarantee him lifetime incarceration, should he show up in the US.
My bet (not actual money understand - the Monopoly pretend kind) is; Snowden will [A.] live individually pretty much okay or [B,] wind up a "traffic statistic." ... In any foreseeable scenario Snowden ends, and an end simply would be the simplest. I differ of course with the majority of my fellow Dip 2.0 commenters, but I won't be *explaining why.
3. Watch what happens to PVT Manning.
Look to (Search) my recent comments. Manning was active-duty uniformed and in-theater. That's Firing Squad. We'll hear of course from time to time of Manning of course, but all mentions will be prefaced with the words, "The Courts." Likely with "UCMJ" predicating.
Snowden on the other hand, should he fall into US "hands" would be more the inconvenience than bin Laden. Better a pedestrian/traffic statistic. "We" don't need (and for damn sure don't want) martyrs.
Arkie
Its still not clear to me whether Snowden is a turn-coat and running an operation for his foreign masters. Russia and China have one thing in common and that is hatred for the US so they may be co-operating in the handling of Snowden. The land mass of those two is so vast Snowden could easily vanish and lead a long life far from the glare of Twitter.
ReplyDeleteHe could also be an idealistic fool, much like so many in the past and is simply running for his life. If he doesn't have another state's resources to protect him, he's a dead man walking with the Obama Administration.....unless of course his digital goodies has more embarrassing secrets against Obama.